Curse

Fried Tech · Mar 27, 2008, 02:07 PM // 14:07

First off, please do not turn this into a arguement about Ursan Blessing being imbalanced.
Over the past couple of months I have seen thread after thread of people ranting and raving against UB. The community is obviously split between the ones who love and those who hate it. One thing that I have not seen is a thread suggesting possible nerfs to the skill.
So, here it is.

If you were to NERF Ursan how would you do it, without totally destroying the skill.

I think changing the energy degen from -2 to -4 would be a nice nerf. If nothing else, this would slow down UB groups because they would have to wait for the skill to recharge, instead of just steamrolling through an area. It might also make some people think twice about using it because when UB drops your energy is at 0, and you don't want that to happen when you are in the middle of battle.

If there is already a thread about this floating around I appolagize.

MithranArkanere · Mar 27, 2008, 02:13 PM // 14:13

The only change it needs is to ingore profession, by disabling primary attribute and armor bonuses under its effect.
There's another thread about that.

Your suggestion will only make the Elementalist and Necromancer ursans the best choice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zting

a BIP in the team and the nerf is no more :P

As far as I can tell the -2energy is immutable, so neither -1/+1 energy properties or skill effects do not change it.

Squishy ftw · Mar 27, 2008, 02:14 PM // 14:14

- make the skills do less damage or stop them from ignoring armor(skill 1)
- increase recharge, a lot
- make that first skill a melee attack that strikes twice, so it can be blocked, missed, blinded

Numa Pompilius · Mar 27, 2008, 02:15 PM // 14:15

Easy. The reason Ursan is broken is because it synergizes with itself. It synergizes with itself through the damage mitigation from the knockdowns: the more ursans in the team, the more time the enemies spend on their collective butts, and the less damage the team takes.

Hence, Ursan should be nerfed by making the AoE knockdown into a single-target knockdown.

That's all it takes. Self-synergy gone, Ursanway dead, but Ursan still useful.

Ghostcell · Mar 27, 2008, 02:27 PM // 14:27

OMG DON'T NERF URSAN WTF URSAN PWNS!!
lol jk.

taking away the energy gain from attacking would be a decent way, heals and all that only heal for 60% of what they would normally would be a decent way to slow groups down without killing the skill.
don't let the first skill do less damage, but make it so it can be blocked.

just a couple of ideas, imo its just a matter of time before ursan does get smacked with the nerf bat.
its just a question of how badly it will be hit.

Fried Tech · Mar 27, 2008, 02:34 PM // 14:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by pfaile

And I know this is the first post in the steam engine to get this thread locked.

*yawn. plz dont post if you have nothing to say about the question at hand. As I stated before there are plenty of threads already outhere complaining/supporting UB. post there. This is a constructive thread for both sides to explain what changes they would make to the skill, and still keep it viable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghostcell

just a couple of ideas, imo its just a matter of time before ursan does get smacked with the nerf bat.
its just a question of how badly it will be hit.

That is exaclty why I started this thread. Lets post some good ideas for ANet to see. Hopefully, that way, they will see what the community thinks and not beat it to death with that Nerf bat... instead just give it a good smack on the head.

CHannum · Mar 27, 2008, 02:36 PM // 14:36

IF I were to nerf UB, which I wouldn't actually do, I'd simply make it so that it performed the same regardless of underlying armor and energy (as was already mentioned). The chief reason I see it as not having been nerfed as opposed to previous PVE skills is that it's open to all classes BUT since not all classes are equal under UB, if it is to be nerfed/made fair, that's what I'd do.

miskav · Mar 27, 2008, 02:39 PM // 14:39

Remove damage taken as energy gain.

MithranArkanere · Mar 27, 2008, 02:43 PM // 14:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by miskav

Remove damage taken as energy gain.

Again, another one that will benefit Elementalists and necromancers.

Making it benefit even more a single profession will not help with it.

Samscwamch · Mar 27, 2008, 02:44 PM // 14:44

Personally i would increase the energy cost and remove -1/+1 so you just have permanent energy degen making it harder to keep up. This would also encourage bringing an actual bar with instead of just ursan and a bunch of resses (pardon me but thats all i see), So during that down time your waiting for your energy and the cooldown on Ursan to wear off your still going to be able to fight and be usefull.

MirkoTeran · Mar 27, 2008, 02:44 PM // 14:44

a) Remove it. Easy.
b) Make it enchantment and give it huge recharge time.
c) Reduce damage by 2/3 and make KD target only.
d) Restrict usage to Norn areas.
e) Leave it as it is. If more then 1 player in team has UB then 3/4 of enemy mobs get UB (the rest turn to monks) and gain 5 levels per number of ursan players. (AKA: Say 'Hi' to level 55 Titans with UB)

Fried Tech · Mar 27, 2008, 02:50 PM // 14:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by MirkoTeran

a) Remove it. Easy.
b) Make it enchantment and give it huge recharge time.
c) Reduce damage by 2/3 and make KD target only.
d) Restrict usage to Norn areas.
e) Leave it as it is. If more then 1 player in team has UB then 3/4 of enemy mobs get UB (the rest turn to monks) and gain 5 levels per number of ursan players. (AKA: Say 'Hi' to level 55 Titans with UB)

a)then we are right back to the death of PUGs we had before UB
b)I like that minus the huge recharge time
c)I agree with the knockdown target only
d)IMHO the skill has done a lot for the game, as far as PUGs go. I believe you should still be able to use in all areas. But it is IMBA at the moment.
e)now thats just mean

IslandHermet · Mar 27, 2008, 02:53 PM // 14:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by MirkoTeran

a) Remove it. Easy.
b) Make it enchantment and give it huge recharge time.
c) Reduce damage by 2/3 and make KD target only.
d) Restrict usage to Norn areas.
e) Leave it as it is. If more then 1 player in team has UB then 3/4 of enemy mobs get UB (the rest turn to monks) and gain 5 levels per number of ursan players. (AKA: Say 'Hi' to level 55 Titans with UB)

He said in his post (lets see if we can nerf it a little not bash its head in with the nerf bat as your post states)

just e or only B would be a good enough nerf to limit it.

MithranArkanere · Mar 27, 2008, 02:56 PM // 14:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samscwamch

Personally i would increase the energy cost and remove -1/+1 so you just have permanent energy degen making it harder to keep up. This would also encourage bringing an actual bar with instead of just ursan and a bunch of resses (pardon me but thats all i see), So during that down time your waiting for your energy and the cooldown on Ursan to wear off your still going to be able to fight and be usefull.

The degen is already permanent.

Please read the behaviour of the skill before suggesting changes:
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Ursan_Blessing

The best possible change is removing armor and primary attribute benefits:
- No extra AL from armor pieces.
- No extra energy from armor pieces.
- No extra effects like knockdown increase or physical damage reduction from warrior insignias and runes.
- No extra energy from primary attribute.

Things like those.

Cebe · Mar 27, 2008, 02:56 PM // 14:56

Moved to PvE Skill Discussion.

Heard moko was hungry.

Arbiter_of_Peril · Mar 27, 2008, 03:09 PM // 15:09

I currently run Slaver's Exile a lot anymore on my monk as a bonder. I currently hate UB with a passion because you don't know how many Ursan W/E that when we tell them to ping thier build they ping a cleverly craft OF build with a normal ping name, but in reality run an Ursan for a group. This ticks me off because... URSAN REMOVES ENCHANTS WHEN USED. Removed enchants with stupid Ursans that dont call UB when used = getting flamed by bonders or just dont get bonded at all and whine when they die.

I personally do not like Ursans, I dont like how powerful the skill is especially with the AoE Knockdown, sure it easy to vanq with other Ursans, but I'll Vanq the Sabway thank you.

My verdict

Ursan Buff : Remove Enchant Removal
Ursan Nerf : Remove AoE Knock Down put it one foe, the first attack shouldn't be a touch but a melee attack so Armor/Blind/Defensive Stance make it useless, as well as reduce the damage of the skills. For that kind of Energy degen the skill is way too powerful

Arbiter_of_Peril · Mar 27, 2008, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Sab made vanquishing easier by doing something people have a hard time doing, creating hero builds that synergize with each other. Sab took 3 Necros and made them work better than normal people. Where on the other hand tards take Ursan stick it on a bar and call it a build. A build is carefully crafted so the skills synergize well with each other and the team. Sure Ursan synergizes well with itself but that is because it is overpowered.

For the record I've always like Necros because behind every great monk there is a good necro

Behind every lame Ursan is another LAME Ursan.

Akolo · Mar 27, 2008, 03:56 PM // 15:56

i would like only a minor nerf. either increase ene degen, remove some dmg, make knockdown only one target, or make the touch skills attack skills instead. (btw have you ever seen a bear knockdown 20 ppl around it? dont think so)

English Warrior · Mar 27, 2008, 04:50 PM // 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by pfaile

I say leave it alone, I am really sorry so many have a problem with others having fun. GET OVER IT. If you want to go crawl thorough an area for 3 to 6 hours with your "elite" builds, go ahead, NO ONE is stopping you.

Just my two pennies.

I just wish there was an official poll, that way the nerf crowd would realize how in the minority they really are.

And I know this is the first post in the steam engine to get this thread locked.

I agree the good thing about ursan is that any profession can use it unlike in the other builds there wasn't builds all around.

- Tain - · Mar 27, 2008, 04:50 PM // 16:50

A reasonable change, imo, would be a complete overhaul of the skill functionality. Instead of replacing your whole bar (which is the biggest crime Ursan commits - making almost all of the other thousands of skills irrelevant) have the norn blessings give a bonus while in effect, in the same model as the derv avatars. Keep your skill bar, have it grant a bonus (something like +100 hp, +10 armor, %chance to KD on attack) last for Z duration and is disabled for Z*1.5 seconds. Not going to happen, but would be the most balanced way to deal with it.